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From Angmar to the Dagor Dagorath. The final story in the Magnificat of the Damned series. The Doom and destiny of the...
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This will be a collection of fics, commissioned art, and gapfillers to flesh out events within my Dark Prince/Magnificat...
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Anthology for short pieces set in or associated with Rohan. Most of these either feature Eowyn or draw on the material on...
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New experiences broaden the mind —trauma and the impossible crack it wide open. A quiet summer holiday, the hint...
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Shoutbox

Naledi
11/14/18 10:49 pm
Oops - meant to say, please DM me with your email address!
Naledi
11/14/18 10:48 pm
Can those of you who want to be involved DM me and I'll send out a group email. Cheeky and Ziggy - I know I did have your emails, but I doubt I've still got them.
Naledi
11/14/18 10:46 pm
Yay for everyone joining in with the advent calendar (*waves to Cheeky*). It's probably time we got this show on the road.
Spiced Wine
11/13/18 10:42 pm
And it will still feel like a last-minute rush!
Spiced Wine
11/13/18 10:41 pm
I do not believe we’re already thinking of Christmas. Yet here I am ordering pressies, buying cards, making sure I have addresses...
NelyafinweFeanorion
11/12/18 02:03 am
YAY!!!
Narya
11/11/18 11:12 pm
Cheeky! Hi! Hope you're well :D and never mind putting up with, we need you to provide crazy plot tangles and lighten things up!
cheekybeak
11/11/18 06:56 pm
Hi there, I’m happy to do the advent story again as long as you can put up with my ridiculousness disrupting your attempts at a more somber mood :-)
Gabriel
11/11/18 04:45 am
"Grins"
Gabriel
11/11/18 03:03 am
Nooooo! Ziggy! Please don't! (a look of horror on face) What about the people trying to stay impartial, trying to see the good in Imrahil! (slips on rose colored glasses) Pleeeeease think about th
Shout Archive



Name: ziggy (Signed) · Date: November 01, 2018 21:38 · For: Chapter 16

I have finally caught up, Encairion! This is epic, huge, magnificent- this rebellion against the Valar that is brewing is wonderful, I LOVE Caranthir and Elured, Elurin - and their strange but rather tender relationship. I am anxious for Maeglin and ther eaction of Tirion when they realise who HE is, Turgon especially, although he seems to be completely penitant. Fabulous sense of a storm building- with all these great heroes converging upon the shores of Aman! Can't wait for Caranthir and Maglor to meet again. Waiting for Fingon, glorious lovely Fingon and his beautfiul Maedhros.



Author's Response:
Yay, I am so happy you like the story this much!   :happy dance: It felt so wonderful to get all these lovely reviews from you, Ziggy!  Thank you so much :hugs:


Ah, Caranthir and the twins, I just want to smuggle them away somewhere that involves lots of happiness, but Valinor is the only place Caranthir could ever head for there will never be true happiness for him without his family.  I want to see Elured and Elurin as adopted Feanorions just like their nephews.  There's something in that Feanorion blood lol
 
Maeglin is definitely in for trouble once his identity is revealed.  There are far too many people walking around that would think justice meant a knife through the back in a dark alley.  
I am also really looking forward to Maglor and Caranthir meeting again!!!  And ah Fingon and Maedhros, we need them back!  I've no doubt their love with have endured, but how will Maedhros' death/the years after Fingon's death have changed him?  So much to explore!
Thank you again for the wonderful reviews :)


Name: merwinem (Signed) · Date: November 01, 2018 15:08 · For: Chapter 16
I tend to think of the Valar as a uniform mass, but you’ve really put some thought into their personalities. Varda’s use of the Children’s souls to extend her own existence isn’t really a surprise at this point. This sort of thing is expected after the Valar allowed Melkor to carry out his terrible experiments on the Elves. Tulkas is clearly a bit slow, and I cannot believe that after several millennia he still hasn’t a clue that he is being manipulated. On the other hand, I’m intrigued by Aule’s refusal to consume not only Elmirion’s soul, but also the other souls offered to him; maybe there is some hope of redemption for him. I don’t think he has ever actually harmed a Child, even if his inaction allowed other Valar to do so. It doesn’t look as if Aule has the willpower to stand with the Elves against his brethren, but if other opportunities to covertly help Feanor present themselves, he will probably act on them.

Celebrian is a true hero, of course. She showed such strength and determination even when she was dying. Turgon and Galadriel have a thing or two to learn from her!

It doesn’t seem that Varda is really in control of Manwe, and, once he is invigorated with youth, hopefully he will do something very highhanded and very stupid, finally displaying the Valar’s true natures to the non-rebellious Elves. Even if the Teleri, the Sindar, and the Silvan are unlikely to join the fight against the Valar, I hope they at least don’t hinder the Noldor.

It is good news that Feanor reacted so strongly to the information that some of the Noldor mistreated the Silvan in Middle-Earth. On the other hand, Varda’s lies about his sons have me worried. No doubt Feanor will mostly blame himself, but a small part of him might see it as a betrayal on his sons’ part. I don’t think reassuring him that he was always loved would be an easy thing to do, especially considering his history – people do tend to let him down. I can see these doubts taking root and dogging him for millennia to come. I think I read something about Maglor contacting his father through the Silmaril in one of the other reviews, and I really hope you include that, because otherwise by the time he is finally reborn Feanor will be a worse wreck than even Curufin.

“I really like the idea of him being instrumental in the Reborn regaining their memories and using a power he had once used for ill now for good.”

Yes, I’m really glad that Maeglin is rethinking his use of the Mind-arts. However, will the other Elves want his help once his identity becomes known? To be fair, I’m not really sure why he is even considered a villain – how did the Gondolindrim jump to the conclusion that he gave up Gondolin’s location willingly? He wasn’t well-liked in Gondolin, but “not well-liked” doesn’t equal “evil”. It’s odd that Idril didn’t see Maeglin for what he was – a person fighting to help the oppressed.

“It's interesting you called Elmirion and Maeglin's relationship a romance, it got me thinking about how little I write sex that isn't romantic in natural -something for me to consider expanding on”

Yeah, I struggled to come up with a name for Elmirion and Maeglin’s relationship. They seem to be closer than friends, so I ended up using the term romance, though that didn’t really fit either. Not least because I seem to remember you are saving Maeglin for Celegorm. As far as your other point goes, I think I prefer that you generally write romantic sex. I feel like complicated interpersonal emotions should be at the forefront, and I see simple desire as not being very complicated. I just don’t think a random hook up between two characters would have the same punch for me, it would be too forgettable.

“I don't feel lost without it, as I have a clear idea of the basic plot points, but that doesn't mean I don't worry that what I've cook-up will pass inspection”

Well, don’t worry about earning my approval; I’m in for the long haul, as far as this story is concerned. Unless you permanently kill off Feanor or have Thingol enslave him or something, then I might have to stop reading for the sake of my own sanity :)

Thank you so much for this incredible story! I’m looking forward to the next chapters.

Author's Response:
""I tend to think of the Valar as a uniform mass, but you’ve really put some thought into their personalities."

I used to think the same, and write them that way.  It wasn't until we made it to this final enstalment of the story that I began thinking about them more as individual personalities with their own ambitions and motivatios.  Before they really did seem to be more of a collective -or at least their goal seemed to be aligned: mantianing power/control.  When I got to thinking about it tho, it made sense that in the past the story presented them in that way because we were seeing the Valar from the Elves' POV, and to them, the Valar DO seem like a hive mind -or at least that they all will obey Manwe when it comes down to it even if they had voiced doubts.

"Varda’s use of the Children’s souls to extend her own existence isn’t really a surprise at this point."

Yeah, it fits all too well with the Valar's histories.  Maybe they should do something about being so predictable lol

"Tulkas is clearly a bit slow, and I cannot believe that after several millennia he still hasn’t a clue that he is being manipulated."

This got me thinking why this might be (if it doesn't just all come down to being slow on the uptake)....and I think it's because of the fading.  Tulkas has only recently consumed an Elven soul at Varda's direction, before that he had had one foot in death's door, and I think, just as Varda says Manwe isn't what he once was, Tulkas wasn't either.  Not only had his physically strength/power been affected, but his cognative ablities as well.  Maybe this explains why the Elves have been able to get away with so much stuff too?  I mean, I love my Elves, but the Valar are vastly more powerful than a Once-lived Elf and with their ablities to spy and even control the Elves in Middle-earth to such an extent that Elrohir didn't know about his family's rebeliion plans until the Valar's powers began to wane, then the Valar should have things more in hand then they do at this point.  but they don't because they are far from the Powers they once were who shaped the world.

Alue: you are right that Feanor might be able to get Alue to work with the Elves against the other Valar.  I think Feanor is the only one tho, as he's the one Alue is obsessed with.  As for if Alue can be redeemed...hmm...maybe?  I think his redemtion would look differnent from say, an Elf's, because in the end he is not one of the Children and I wonder how capable he is of feeling things like remorse or really understanding that what the Valar are doing is wrong.  He can be motivated to help them if Feanor gives him something he wants (or just convinces him he will), but I think it more likely that he will help them out of self-interest then out of remorse.

Manwe: to be honest, I am not yet sure what Manwe is going to do now.  It is entertly likely he will make a mess of things, but he might do the opposite as well and actually GAIN the Valar more followers.  He can be quite supaficially charming, now he's back to his old self.  His character would make a good polotician -in the short term-- but time would show how hollow his shine really is.  But there are a lot of Elves running around Valinor who still worship the Valar, and a charasmatic Manwe might bind them even tighter.

Feanor: yeah, Varda's lies are not going to help his mental state at ALL.  They are so dangerous because they have plucked chords that already existed in him.  He already blamed himself, and he has a history of doubting his own self-worth and wondering when the people who love him now will leave him.  I hope Maglor does figure out a way to contact him!  His father needs him!

Maeglin:  I think you are right on that only a select number of Elves will want his help.  But I do foresee him able to help Aegnor and Angrod out tho.  I think it will depend on the views of the reborn Elves' families about him.
"To be fair, I’m not really sure why he is even considered a villain – how did the Gondolindrim jump to the conclusion that he gave up Gondolin’s location willingly?"
I have wondered this too -about cannon Maeglin.  It's been a while since I read the Fall of Gondolin, but, unless I am misremembering, Tuor somehow came to the conclution that Maeglin was a traitor BEFORE Maeglin's confruntation with Idril on the walls, and sent his House to attack Maeglin's.  I tend to think he was going off of suspicions rather than any real evidance, and since I read cannon as heavily influenced by racist views against non-Noldor, I read everything that happened in Gondolin with a bucket of salt.  I mean, how did the Gondolin know that Maeglin wasn't tortured and gave up Gondolin's location for a deal with Morgoth?  How do they know Idril was the promised price?  It all seems very suspicious to me and like the kind of thing the survivors told themselves after to further villafy Maeglin.  Why was it so important to them that Maeglin wasn't tortured?  Porbalbly because they wanted him to be the ultimate villian in the stories that they were free to hate without a shred of pity for what he'd endured. 
As for how the Gondolindhrim in this story decided it was Maeglin who betrayed them, well, I think that while everyone was eager to pretend that Maeglin's disparerance leading up to Gondolin's Fall wasn't anything worth investigating at the time, in hindsight they questioned it.  And, coupled with Tuor and Idril's story of what happened on the wall with Earneidel (who Maeglin DID threatened to kill, tho WE know he wasn't in his right mind at the time, to an out-of-the-know outsider his actions look pretty evil), the Gondolindhrim were more then comfortable pointing the finger at Maeglin.

"Yeah, I struggled to come up with a name for Elmirion and Maeglin’s relationship. They seem to be closer than friends, so I ended up using the term romance, though that didn’t really fit either."

I am glad to hear I didn't completely miss-interpret how their relationship came off!  And yes, I did have thoughts of Maeglin/Celegorm later, but we will see how the story flows, someone else might pop up :)

"As far as your other point goes, I think I prefer that you generally write romantic sex. I feel like complicated interpersonal emotions should be at the forefront, and I see simple desire as not being very complicated. I just don’t think a random hook up between two characters would have the same punch for me, it would be too forgettable."

Oh, yes, you are quite right.  I didn't mean to imply that I wanted to start writing a bunch of hook-ups.  I feel like sex-scenes, just like any other scene, needs to serve a purpose in the story.  If the sex scene isn't revealing something new about the character or driving the plot forward, then it should not be included.  And usually causal sex-scenes don't add anything to the story.  What I meant was that I tend to explore exclusivly 'end game' pairings.  But sex can be about more than romance, it can serve a differnt kind of intimacy, or it can be about hate or vengnace, and I think I'd like to explore that more.  Tho maybe I am just not rememebering all the varied sex scenes I've written in the past.....it's terrible but I can't always remember what happened in my own story lol  Often, when writing a character we haven't seen for a while, I have to go back and re-read what I've written about them in the past.

"Unless you permanently kill off Feanor or have Thingol enslave him or something, then I might have to stop reading for the sake of my own sanity :)"

I swear to you a sacred vow this will NEVER happen lol  Feanor would stab Thingol's eyes out first and, as much as I love my angst, this story without Feanor in it wouldn't be worth reading lol  

Thank you so, so much for this great review!  You always make me so happy when I see you've commented!!!



Name: ziggy (Signed) · Date: November 01, 2018 8:28 · For: Chapter 8

Brilliant ideas, Encairion- so compelling and intriguing. I did cheer Idril and Elenwë but they are becoming as tyrannical as Turgon. Poor old Finarfin. And glorious Finrod!



Author's Response:
Idril really is her father's daughter, even if she wishes she wasn't now.  Their natures are similar, both are too narrow-minded, too black and white in their thinking.  At lest Idril is TRYING to be better than she was, but ruling is a heavy burden and power doesn't usually bring out the best of people.  She just has such a narrow view of the world, one that doesn't lend itself to shades of grey -or forgiveness.  She thinks she is pursuing justice, but what is justice without clemency?  Without compassion or empathy?  That said, I am not without hope for her character either.  She might just be able to grow and change, but maybe I am just being too hopeful as far as Turgon and Idril are concerned.

I am so glad you liked Finrod :)


Name: ziggy (Signed) · Date: October 31, 2018 21:54 · For: Chapter 3

This is a marvellous chapter- moving between a luscious sexuality to the fine politics and machinations of Turgon. I am afraid that Anaire is right htough- much as I like Finarfin, he is a weak leader- too ashamed, to hesitant and apolgetic. He needs to kick Turgid's ass!

 

Wonderful snippet with Ecthelion about to confess (presumably their cowardice).



Author's Response:
I agree with you about Finarfin.  I like him too, but he's not king material.  But then, not everyone is born to be a king.  Finarfin makes a great concealer or conciliator, king tho, not so much.  On the other hand, he was the leader the Noldor needed before this.  They needed a leader without too much pride who could slip under the Valar's radars.  Finarfin accomplished something few others could have, even the great kings of his family -he convinced the Valar to start releasing the Dead.


"Wonderful snippet with Ecthelion about to confess (presumably their cowardice)."

I am glad he got a chance at redemption.  I feel like Gondolin was the worst thing to happen to him -to many of the Gondolindhrim.  They might have been quite different people if they hadn't lived in a society that enabled all their worst traits and allowed them to indulge the worst of humanity.  Not that society is all to blame for their choices, especially since the lords of Gondoldin were the ones to BUILD that society, but still, it certianly didn't help them become better people in any sense. (Wow, I'm shocking myself here with having some sympathy for the Gondolndhrim lol)



Name: ziggy (Signed) · Date: October 31, 2018 21:27 · For: Chapter 2

Wonder we we all hate Turgon so much?? I absolutely share your views completely.But now you are starting to reveal Tirion and Valinor- I love the idea of the city being partially demolished, the reality of not having enough accommodation etc. And the delicate relationship  between  Finarfin and Elenwe, and the jelousy of Turgon. Great stuff!! I can't wait for Elrohir to get there!!



Author's Response:
"Wonder we we all hate Turgon so much??"

Hmm, that is the question...I think it's Gondolin that gives me the creeps the most.  Tho Maeglin/Eol's treatment there is also something I have a bone to pick with that place and Turgon as it's king since I read the way they are both written as throwing racist shade on them/non-Noldor in general.  But then, I also don't like much of what we know of Turgon either, from the way he didn't show up for the Battle of Sudden Flames, to how he retreated after Fingon died back to Gondolin leaving Fingon's people and the Humans living in those lands to be slaughtered or fall under tyranny, to how he didn't even come out to fight when Gondolin fell but died in his tower.  It just doesn't leave me with a favorable impression of him.  But for all that, and for all I've written here in the opening chapters of this story, I'm not ruling out the possibility of positive character growth for him in the future.  He may have needed to hit rock bottom before he can really look at who he is and what he's done (tho maybe he will refuse to change too, his character is terribly stubborn and prideful once he's dug his heels in, we shall see what happens!).

I am glad to hear how much you like the descriptions of Tirion in the Third Age :)

"I can't wait for Elrohir to get there!!"

He would really shake things up!  He's like the complete opposite of so many of these Elves, full of fire (and darkness).


Name: ziggy (Signed) · Date: October 31, 2018 21:02 · For: Chapter 1

brilliant idea! compelling and intriguing ideas, wonderful writing.



Name: ziggy (Signed) · Date: October 31, 2018 19:28 · For: Chapter 1

Which now makes sense since I read the last chapter of The Lost children - and realised what is happening here. I had starte dreading it but was very confused. Now I get it- and know what is happening.

 

Beautiful writing my dear Encairion. Such gorgoeus imagery.



Author's Response:

I am sorry to hear it was confusing at first!  But it's wonderful to hear you are enjoying it now :D  Thanks for the kind words :)



Name: kasura (Signed) · Date: October 28, 2018 22:25 · For: Chapter 16
Maeglin and Elmirion squeaaaalllll!!! The story of how these 2 reborn and relearn their skills and identities just amazing - and showing the extent of Valar's scheme to control the Noldor reborn. My question is do the Sindar who got reeled by Namo's call to stay in Mandos, do they go through the same treatment or just the Noldor? what about the mixed Noldor/Sindar elves? If the Sindar are able to reborn without going through this reconditioning, omg that shows the Valar are seriously scared of the Noldor...

It's just me or I think Varda's plan of releasing Maeglin gonna backfire on her fake pristine face XD. All these work just to be with Melkor? sheesh...and how her pride going to bust when she found out Melkor wants Feanor instead of her?

The fall of the Valar - you have it tying nicely with the Flame Imperishable in the elves that the Valar jealously want - not surprising they turn into disgusting leeches to feed on Elven souls to stay in power. The Valar are never meant to be living with the elves and be their rulers. There's too much of power imbalance for them not to abuse that power in the name of the good.

I assume Celebrian found out about Valar's dirty little secret through Elmirion's mirror?

Wow I feel so many plots and side plots cross and in parallel - this is so complex in a magnificent way. I can't wait for Caranthir to show up and meet Elmirion!

urghhh My gut feel is Varda wants to restore Turgon back to Noldor Kingship, by releasing Maeglin :(

Author's Response:
"Maeglin and Elmirion squeaaaalllll!!!"

I feel exactly the same :grins:

"My question is do the Sindar who got reeled by Namo's call to stay in Mandos, do they go through the same treatment or just the Noldor? what about the mixed Noldor/Sindar elves? If the Sindar are able to reborn without going through this reconditioning, omg that shows the Valar are seriously scared of the Noldor..."

Hmm, good questions.  I think the Doom would fall on the shoulders of any descendant of an Exile, even one of mixed blood, so they would receive the same treatment.  I can't remember if I've written anywhere of Sindar, Silvan, ect who was dragged (or choose) Mandos....I don't think so, but correct me if I am mistaken.  So I am going to go with the thought that the Valar just didn't care enough about these Elves to try and haul them to Mandos.  We see this attitude in the way they never bothered to finish cleaning up Morgoth's mess time and again, and how they didn't care to intervene when Morgoth almost took over Beleriand even though the Sindar, Silvan, ect had never 'rebelled.'  I think this shows a general lack of care for what became of the Elves who never choose the Trees in the first place.  So, I am going to assume that all these Elves are being reborn in new Menegoth, or are wandering around houseless.

"It's just me or I think Varda's plan of releasing Maeglin gonna backfire on her fake pristine face XD."

It defiantly could!  Even though Varda understands the way Elves/the Children think better how that she absorbed Irime's soul, she still doesn't perceive all the layers.  Does she REALLY know how Idril/ the other Noldor will react?  Or is she just making assumptions?  

"and how her pride going to bust when she found out Melkor wants Feanor instead of her?"

Yes, the irony is that even is she accomplished everything she set out to and released a Melkor who had consumed Feanor's soul, he would still reject her.

"The fall of the Valar - you have it tying nicely with the Flame Imperishable in the elves that the Valar jealously want"

I am thrilled to hear it is working so far!

"The Valar are never meant to be living with the elves and be their rulers. There's too much of power imbalance for them not to abuse that power in the name of the good."

I agree with you so much!  This is like, one of my major problems with the Valar and their 'rule' of Arda.  They can essentially enforce anything they want by right of might; they can annihilate nations and entire people who rebel against their rule.  So when they flex their muscles and insert themselves into the affairs of the Children -like how they did when Feanor drew his sword on Fingolfin which was an internal Noldor matter that Finwe should have and needed to address-- it opens the door to all kinds of problems.

"I assume Celebrian found out about Valar's dirty little secret through Elmirion's mirror?"

Oooo she could have gotten the idea that way!  I had thought that the Third Age Elves like Elrond, Celebrain, Glorinfdel ect had brainstormed a host of ideas in preparation for their way against the Valar, and trying to influence them/sway them to their side with Oswene was one of their ideas, and Celebrain was the first one to get a change to use it and was desperate enough to try even if it backfired spectacularly.

"Wow I feel so many plots and side plots cross and in parallel - this is so complex in a magnificent way. I can't wait for Caranthir to show up and meet Elmirion!"

Ahhhh!  I love hearing this!  Thank you!  And yay for Caranthir and Elmirion's coming meeting!  I can't wait either :grins:

"urghhh My gut feel is Varda wants to restore Turgon back to Noldor Kingship, by releasing Maeglin :("

Save us all!  But I am thinking even the Valar are smart enough not to bet on the dead horse.  Turgon's reputations is in such tatters that even if he only had to win the popularity with his own people from Gondolin he might be in trouble at this point.  

Thank you so, so much for this lovely review!  It's so wonderful to hear you are still enjoying the story (despite the sluggish updates)!


Name: merwinem (Signed) · Date: October 27, 2018 19:47 · For: Chapter 15
Thank you for these chapters! I wasn’t expecting to see Elmirion and Maeglin so soon and this was a wonderful surprise!

I’m glad Maeglin had an opportunity to get to know the Noldor anew, to be introduced to them outside the toxic society of Gondolin. Helping the Reborn break through the Valar’s enchantments is an excellent use of his gift. Elrond, once he arrives in Valinor, might be able to help as well. He was probably the one who fixed whatever Galadriel broke inside Maglor’s head, so he already has some experience in healing minds. And he has a Ring!

I like the parallel between Elmirion and Feanor - people stop to listen to them, but generally dislike them for some reason. I hope this isn’t foreshadowing of things to come, though. I’m hoping the Elves’ attitudes toward Feanor change by the end of the story – if they had listened to him in the first place (before the Darkening), they probably wouldn’t still be under the Valar’s thumb.

The Elmirion/Maeglin romance was set up pretty well, considering that the events took place over a single chapter. Well done! At the moment things are relatively uncomplicated for the pair of them. Of course this is only an illusion of safety - all it will take is just a single person who recognises Maeglin or Elmirion (who can probably be easily identified by anyone who knew Celebrimbor).

I’m not sure how Maeglin fits into Varda’s plan to topple Idril. I doubt he can reveal any information that can undermine her. I assume the slaughter of the Silvan Elves who tried to escape the valley of Gondolin is common knowledge. And in any case, that was Turgon’s fault more so than Idril’s. Maybe Varda expects Idril to give Maeglin a punishment that is so over the top (especially considering that he doesn’t even remember his crime) that public opinion turns against her?

So… I guess if Varda wants to overthrow Idril, she will have to replace her with someone else. The Valar need a pliant ruler in Tirion, and Finwe is the only pro-Valar Noldo King. If Finwe comes back it will be interesting to see what his perspective on past three Ages is. And he has a lot to make up for, so he better get started right away. In any case, Valinor is becoming a Gordian knot, and I’m looking forward to seeing how you untangle it!

I think the new information about the Valar requires its own review. I’ll see if I can organize my thoughts and post it in a few days :)

Author's Response:
Thank you so much for the review!!!  

I remember that you guessed a while back that Maeglin and Elmirion would be reborn together.  When writing the rebirth process I was doubly glad they had each other since it seems like such a lonely experience.  While they have all these other Reborn around them, the struggle to remember and the fears of never remembering is a heavy burden that needs a friend (and that's not even mentioning how difficult it will be once people start finding out who they are).

"I’m glad Maeglin had an opportunity to get to know the Noldor anew, to be introduced to them outside the toxic society of Gondolin. Helping the Reborn break through the Valar’s enchantments is an excellent use of his gift."

I am glad he got to get to know the Noldor outside of Gondolin too; it will really help him when he starts getting his memories of Gondolin back.  I also didn't forget what you said in your review on Maeglin's story about how his liberal, compassless use of the mind-arts really bothered you.  It left me thinking more deeply about it, and how I could incorporate that into character growth/ a plot point for him, so thank you again for pointing that out!  I really like the idea of him being instrumental in the Reborn regaining their memories and using a power he had once used for ill now for good.  Elrond should be able to help too, tho he is still a few decades from sailing, I think (I am not 100% sure when in the 3rd Age this is happening, but somewhere in the last century).

It's interesting that you mentioned how Elmirion reminds you of Feanor, as I spent a while thinking about which of the Curufinwes he resembles most.  They defiantly all have that ability to rub people the wrong way!  I think they all have a lot in common, more than just the first glance of a love for crafting lol  They are all pretty terrible at politics, for one thing -looking at you too Curufin!  Curufin makes an attempt to play the game in Nargothrod, but Finrod vastly over-estimates his talent for it.  I don't think Curufin's plans to steal half of Finrod's army would have actually worked out if Finrod was still around, and, of course, we see how badly the debacle with Luthian turned out.  I don't think Curufin's failure to hold onto power in Nargothrond had so much to do with Luthian and Beren spreading the word of Finrod's death and trying to spin it all to be the Feanorion's fault, as it did the simple fact that Curufin wasn't well-liked and didn't actively charm people to get what he wanted.  He didn't really pretend to be someone he wasn't, and so no amount of spy networks or plotting could overcome his shear unlikeabilty to most of Nargothrond.  It wasn't Curufin who gained most of the loyalty the Feanorion's captured in Nargothrond, after all, but Celegorm.  That doesn't mean Curufin doesn't have charisma -we see that he does when he speaks before the assembled people of Nargothrond-- but he isn't a natural charmer, and, coupled with his cold and haughty exterior, he doesn't make allies easily. 

I used to think Elmirion resembled Celebrimbor most, but the more I thought about him, the more I thought he had the most in common with Curufin.  But I remember Celebrimbor seeing Feanor strongly in his son. The major difference I see between Curufin and Elmorion and Feanor is how they deal with their hurt and how they tackle problems.  Feanor is very outwardly expressive in a lot of ways, and can be, honestly, dramatic, whereas Curufin and Elmerion will keep the hurt inside.  Similarly, when Feanor believes in something he will charge in and try to fix it head on, but Elmorion and Curufin are behind the scenes planners and plotters.  Well, at least those are my current insights into Elmrion's character, but we haven't seen him much so far, so maybe he will turn out differently :)

"I’m hoping the Elves’ attitudes toward Feanor change by the end of the story – if they had listened to him in the first place (before the Darkening), they probably wouldn’t still be under the Valar’s thumb."

Yes, I am hoping that the Elves who have demonized for so long are able to finally see his humanity in the end.  He's not a monster, just a flawed man who loved with everything he is and wanted the best for his people.  How different things could have been if he'd gotten his wish and was able to lead all those who wanted to out of Valinor before Melkor struck!  If Feanor and his people had reached Beleriand tho peaceful means and were able to connect with the local inhabitants without the shadow of Alqualondë hanging over them and the Oath enslaving them!  But then, that would have been an entirely different book.

"The Elmirion/Maeglin romance was set up pretty well, considering that the events took place over a single chapter. Well done! At the moment things are relatively uncomplicated for the pair of them. Of course this is only an illusion of safety - all it will take is just a single person who recognizes Maeglin or Elmirion (who can probably be easily identified by anyone who knew Celebrimbor)."

Yes, it really is only the illusion of safety; the rug can so easily be pulled out from under their feet :(  It's interesting you called Elmirion and Maeglin's relationship a romance, it got me thinking about how little I write sex that isn't romantic in natural -something for me to consider expanding on.  I hadn't seen Elmrion and Maeglin's relationship as romantic, but it is defiantly more intimate than a friend's with benefits affair.  I am not quite sure how to quantify it...maybe the characters will decided they want a romance and forget what I think lol

" Maybe Varda expects Idril to give Maeglin a punishment that is so over the top (especially considering that he doesn’t even remember his crime) that public opinion turns against her?"

Yeah, that is what Varda is hoping for.  Idril has name a lot of enemies, most in the reborn Gondolindhrim, but if she were to try to execute Maeglin they would be the only ones happy about it.  While Maeglin is the ultimate villain in the Gondolhrim's books, he is a hero to the Wood-elves who escaped Gondolin and they spread the word of what happened in Gondolin among their people.  And while the Wood-Elves aren't in Valinor, some of their mixed descendants are, as well as some Sindar, and, of course, the Teleri.  How much some of these folks will care about Maeglin's actions in Gondolin is debatable, but at least they will be running with an alternative narrative to the 'born evil' 'super villain one the Gondolindhrim want everyone to believe.  But we will see if Idril plays into Varda's hands of not; Varda does have a history of her plans blowing up in her face.  While she understands the Elves better now that she absorbed Irime, she is still quite alien and a lot goes over her head.  She expects Idril to revile Maeglin, but does she?  And if she does, is she short-sighted enough to fall into the Valar's trap?

"The Valar need a pliant ruler in Tirion, and Finwe is the only pro-Valar Noldo King. If Finwe comes back it will be interesting to see what his perspective on past three Ages is. And he has a lot to make up for, so he better get started right away."

You read my mind, yet again!  Finwe is who they would look to next.  Tho you are quite right to ask if he will emerge from Mandos the same man the Valar remember.

" In any case, Valinor is becoming a Gordian knot, and I’m looking forward to seeing how you untangle it!"

I love hearing this!!!  We have officially left the beaten path of cannon, and I confess that I worry about my ability to weave an interesting and complex plot line without the framework of cannon that I have been working around up to now.  Even tho trying to fight things around the basic framework of cannon has been a headache at times, it always pushed the story forward in a general direction.  I don't feel lost without it, as I have a clear idea of the basic plot points, but that doesn't mean I don't worry that what I've cook-up will pass inspection :)

Thank you ever so much for this great review, and your continued and priceless support as I inch my way through the story :hugs:


Name: Spiced Wine (Signed) · Date: October 26, 2018 12:17 · For: Chapter 16

Elmírion and Maeglin! I a so pleased to see the, and that they have been reborn together! I have missed them, even if they are not yet who they were. {{{Hugs them}}}


But I am fascinated an appalled by Varda’s machinations and utterly horrified at what she has done, and how she is trying to break Fëanor through lies. I am incandescent with fury! 
Not wanting to utterly destroy the Noldor but keep them unthreatening, as good pets. Well, I think this plan is going to fall on it’s backside spectacularly! And Irimë’s soul? really? Good god, I hope she does not come back in any way, Glorfindel suffered enough! There’s a great deal of similarity between Varda and Irimë however! And all for Melkor...? Well that makes sense! 
(By the bye, Celebrían’s act with Estë was actually quite brilliant) 
And who, WHO, is the soul Varda now has? My god, these chapters were amazing, I shall have to read through again when I have finished my work! Well done! Plans within plans, plots within plots! 




Author's Response:

I am glad at least Maeglin and Elmirion are together!  It would have been too sad for Maeglin to be reborn alone –not only because of this beginning period of his rebirth, but think of how bad it’s going to get once it gets out that he’s back?  He needs a true friend.  I don’t want his second life to turn into the level of tragedy he endured in his first life, poor baby.

I feel you about Varda!  Hasn’t Feanor suffered enough?  And yes, Irime’s soul, could it be anyone worse!  Because, although Varda is either in denial or is unaware, Irime has had more influence on Varda’s personality then she acknowledges.  The Varda of before was pretty checked-out from the affairs of Arda and the Children, she didn’t even care that much about Melkor anymore, she’d become numb to it all.  She felt like what the Valar really are: alien life.  But the moment Irime’s soul was infused with Varda’s, Varda ‘awoke.’  Not only did Varda suddenly start caring again –her passion for Melkor reawakened—but, just like with Este, only to a lesser extent, what Irime loved, Varda loved, and what Irime hated, Varda hated.  I don’t think it’s any coincidence that Varda choose to try and destroy Feanor above all else, whether she realizes she singled out Feanor because of Irime’s hatred of him or not.  On the other hand, Varda’s compromised feelings about Glorfindel and Maglor might just be the only thing that gets them to Valinor.  With Manwe reawaked, I could easily see him trying to destroy any ship Glorfindel and Maglor sailed back on.  So it might just be another example of the Valar shooting themselves in the foot.

(By the bye, Celebrían’s act with Estë was actually quite brilliant)”

I am glad you liked it!  I think it was a plan the rebel Elves of the Third Age came up with as a potential way to try and get the souls of the dead free.  I think they have spent a lot of time brainstorming ideas, and Celebrain was able to put one into practice.  I imagine the Elves originally envisioned one of the more powerful Valar like Niennor or Irmo or Ulmo, or all of them at once, as who they’d try to influence, but with so many Valar fading, Celebrain made due with what she had.  I think it worked out for the best tho, Este is one of the least powerful as well as being one of the less controlling ones, and thus more receptive to being influenced.  I don’t think Celebrain knew exactly what would happen when she used Óswine on a Valar, but she got great results!  She is Galadriel’s daughter after all, I think her mind-magic has quite a kick to it!

“And who, WHO, is the soul Varda now has?”

For Manwe?  A poor Vanyar child killed during the Purge (when the Valar dragged all Finarfin’s allies off to become puppets at their feet).  Varda wanted a young, malleable soul, and thought a Vanya would tickle Manwe the most.  But she had to wait for a Vanya child to die –something that doesn’t happen often.  In fact, this child might be one of the first, maybe even THE first Vanyar child to die since the Elves came to Valinor.  After all, the Vanyar children were not brought to the War of Wrath.  I don’t imagine Manwe wanted to fuse with a Noldo child tho, and other then them there were only the Teleri to choose from.  If any children died in the Kinslaying, then they were long reborn.  And that is a big IF.  Personally, it doesn’t make sense to me that Teleri children would have died in the Kinslaying since Feanor was trying to steal the ships.  Logically, he would have tried to take them when the city slept.  From there the battle spread out along the beaches and docks, maybe the neighborhoods next to the docks, but maybe not.  I think it depends on how long the battle lasted.  But we don’t know many details about any of the Kinslayings.  Anyway, since the Sindar, Silvan ect never entered Mandos, Varda seized upon the child’s soul.  A truly despicable crime.

Thank you so much for your review!  I am feeling nervous about how long it’s taking to get to the ‘main’ action, so it’s wonderful to hear how much you are still enjoying it :hugs: 



Name: kasura (Signed) · Date: September 04, 2018 5:17 · For: Chapter 14
Let me repeat myself, what complex worldbuilding you have done so far, with the political unrest and cultural clashing between the Exiles and different elven races in Valinor, the Underground Resistance, and the stifling neo Doriath, where Thingol got even crazier and more sick with his ego boost, and these Sindar, either too brainwashed or too afraid to challenge Thingol, just turn blind to the evils things he did, or enable him to create more evils. I don’t feel so far this arc is tying up loose ends, it’s like tying up some ends, and then unravel more loose ends, more questions, and new challenges. It’s amazing…I am loving your chapters so much :)

Melian’s enslavement by Thingol surprised me lol. I just assume she was sent there by the Valar to corral the Sindar and preach Valinorean values to them. Hmm I guess the Valar don’t really care whether Melian was enslaved by them or enslaved by Poldorea…as long as they got Luthien’s descendants to bring the Silmaril to them and ruled the Men, they don’t care who’s the Enslaver. And do the Valar not care Poldorea still can exert some power despite being dead? Am glad the Silvan found out about the Land, and stopped their sacrifices to the Land.

So now that begs the question of whether the Silvan will fight with their fellow Valinor elves against the Valar. Having their belief smashed by Elured/Elurin telling them the truth, would they now see the Valar as a more sinister force, being in the same cohort as Poldorea, will that be enough to motivate the Silvan to fight against the Valar? I think with more of their own like Legolas of Greenwood losing the fight against sea longing and sailing to Valinor, I can see the Silvan edging towards fighting against these oppressors. But the Sindar, forget it…I don’t see the Sindar lifting their fingers against the Valar. They will sit tight in their neo Doriath, business as usual. At the worst I can see the Sindar trying to sabotage the war against the Valar?

And ENTERS Caranthir!!! He’s one of my fav Feanorions…and he doesn’t disappoint! I love love how he’s grumpy, no nonsense, say it as it is, non-apologetic & absolute devotion to his family and Curufin. The way he deals with Thingol, you go Caranthir!!! And he takes Elured & Elurin under his wings, because these two needs someone like Caranthir to protect and watch out for them. Their relatives are perfectly okay turning blind eyes to Thingol abusing them…but Caranthir steps in to save the twins. Now they have each other – sniffles. Can’t wait for the twins to meet Elrond. Elrond would be so shocked by his uncles got adopted by Caranthir :)

BTW Caranthir’s rebirth is pppppperfect!

Caranthir arriving in Valinor will be so interesting. Everyone has changed…Finarfin, Finrod, Angrod…they all changed so I am eager to see Caranthir interacting with the transformed Arafinwean side of the extended family. I think Caranthir will see them in a different light….looking forward to how Curufin/Caranthir/Finrod tangle is going to be sorted out XD

Author's Response:
"I don’t feel so far this arc is tying up loose ends, it’s like tying up some ends, and then unravel more loose ends, more questions, and new challenges. It’s amazing…I am loving your chapters so much "

Thank you!!!!  I feel you on this too, it does feel like there are even MORE things to explore, rather then was winding up to the end.  To be honest, it's more than a little overwhelming when I think about how long I imagine this story is going to be, but at the same time I am itching to write so many character again and final get a chance to give them some happiness!

"Melian’s enslavement by Thingol surprised me lol."

I am glad it was a surprise!  Honestly, I could see it going either way for these two: Melian the enslaver/enchantress, or Thingol being the one.  Either way, their relationship does not strike me as a happy romance.  As for the Valar not caring about Thingol wielding her Power, I think it's more that they don't seem to care about what happens in Middle-earth in general.  They never did anything about the many Maiar who followed Melkor after they captured Melkor, they just let them run loose around Middle-earth!  I do think they would care about Poldorea tho, I just don't think they know it was him behind Melian's chaining.  They have to have some idea that the two dead Valar are still present in the world, but I think they underestimate them, thinking they a defeated foe -they definitely underestimated Melkor, after all, when they let him loose.

Will the Silvan fight in the war is a good question.  You are right that there are reasons for them to see the Valar as their enemies, but at the same time, are they willing to leave Middle-earth that they love to go to a foreign land and fight alongside their once-oppressors, the Noldor?  Some have reason to go to Valinor like Eol and Bregolas who will seek Maeglin, but what of the others who have no loved ones there?  It's a big question, and one that could potentially swing the war in the Elves' favor if they can band together against a common foe.  But will they be able to let old hurts go, even for their common freedom?  I think it's a question the Teleri will be facing in Valinor too.  

I am so thrilled you liked Caranthir :happy jig:  He always needs more love   I wish there were more stories centered around him.

"Caranthir arriving in Valinor will be so interesting. Everyone has changed…Finarfin, Finrod, Angrod…they all changed so I am eager to see Caranthir interacting with the transformed Arafinwean side of the extended family. I think Caranthir will see them in a different light….looking forward to how Curufin/Caranthir/Finrod tangle is going to be sorted out XD"

You bring up an excellent point about everything having changed!  I, too, wonder how his interactions with the Arafinwean's will be.  There can be no doubt they share a common goal.  But will he be holding grudges against them and vis versa?  I think Caranthir is a guy who can be surprisingly forgiving as long as the person he's got a problem with acknowledges their fault and starts shaping up.  If, for instance Finrod, starts calling him a Kinsalayer and shoving all his own guilt about Alquendie onto Caranthir, Caranthir is not going to take that lying down, but if Finrod is welcoming and sees Caranthir as his family first, then, even with how jealous Caranthir was over Curufin, I think Carnathir could work with Finrod with only the usual about of arguments (Carnathir will still be Caranthir lol).  Aegnor and his meeting will be an interesting one too, seeing as they cannonly butted heads a lot.  They both have hasty tempers and fiery personalities, but Aegnor remembers nothing of their past and both he and Caranthir are people who don't like to gnaw on grudges.  I can see them clashing often because of their personalities, but getting over it quickly as long as the other does.

Thank you so much for the review!  You sparked ideas in my head with this discussion!!!



Name: Spiced Wine (Signed) · Date: September 03, 2018 21:07 · For: Chapter 14
It's all so sad, and even more so when I think about Curufin. Feanor's own son had lost the heart of who Feanor was, thinking that getting vengeance would have made Feanor happier than seeing Curufin learning to live on without him.

That is so so heartbreaking. One of the most gut-wrenching pieces of writing I have ever read, published or no, is Cururfin’s breakdown after the Beren and Lúthien meeting. And later, before the attack on Doriath when he was almost mad, really. Celebrimbor thought he had forgotten who Fëanor was, and you’re right; he had.

One of the things I love, though, is that there is so much story in this, so much to write about, because it;s not going to be a case of reborn = happy-ever-after.

Author's Response:
"That is so so heartbreaking. One of the most gut-wrenching pieces of writing I have ever read, published or no, is Cururfin’s breakdown after the Beren and Lúthien meeting."

I remember weeping when I was writing that scene.  It was such an emotional wringer; Curufin made me love his character absolutely in that moment, and I have wanted nothing but some damn happiness for my baby ever since.  
Curufin really had forgotten who Feanor was, tho.  And I have no doubt Feanor will blame himself for Curufin self-destruction.  Of course swearing the Oath had a large part in Curufin's breaking, but equally did the doubts and guilt Curufin suffering after Melkor's killing of Finwe, and if Feanor had been more himself, he would have seen something was wrong and done everything he could to make Curufin understand the depth of his love.  But that didn't happen, so the doubts were never silenced and continued to grow over the years until they consumed Curufin.

"One of the things I love, though, is that there is so much story in this, so much to write about, because it;s not going to be a case of reborn = happy-ever-after."

Yes, that's so true.  Rebirth will not erase what came before, and wiping their memories is not healing, it's just another form of destruction.  So the dead will be reborn knowing exactly what not only dying felt like, but what if left like to loose the ones they loved.  I wonder if this will become a crippling fear for some of the reborn?  Will they fear to face-off against the Valar because they are afraid of loosing their loved ones again?....hmm, I think that's something to explore...



Name: merwinem (Signed) · Date: September 01, 2018 21:08 · For: Chapter 14
Thank you for this amazing update!

It’s incredibly sad that the twins had this huge family, but were utterly alone at the same time. All their numerous relations were either unable or unwilling to stand up to their abuser. It took a kinslayer to do what was needed to be done. And, as a result, yet another pair of twins from Thingol’s line chooses the Feanorions over their own family. It will be interesting to see what their mother’s perspective on their new relationship with Caranthir will be when she is reborn.

I feel so bad for Elmo, he is such a tragic character. Both of his lives were ruined by the same man, the person who was supposed to be his protector. And Elmo actually cared about the twins, even if he couldn’t do anything to help. I hope we see him again and he finds peace and happiness. I’m not sure where he could go once he escapes Menegroth, other than seeking out Celeborn or Thranduil. However, Celeborn seems to idealize Doriath and might refuse to listen to anything that might tarnish his memories of the place. I think Thranduil is more critical of Doriath, though.

Thingol is horrible. Out of the trio of Thingol, Ingwe and Finwe, Finwe is without a doubt the least bad both as a king and as a father, and that’s saying something. The saddest thing is that Caranthir was right – there had to have been people who knew about Thingol’s crimes and did nothing. And some Elves actually gave their children to Thingol willingly – it’s just awful. So much for the Sindar’s moral superiority…

I loved how you brought the dead Valar into this. It was interesting to get a glimpse of Melian’s perspective - she seems to think that her freedom from Thingol is only temporary, expecting to be overpowered yet again as soon as he is reborn. I guess the only way to break the cycle is to prevent Thingol from accessing the Land’s magic which he uses to enslave Melian. It’s interesting that the Valar didn’t bother hunting her down and collaring her a second time. I assume Manwe didn’t see Thingol as a threat even if he was armed with a Maia’s power.

All of this has me thinking about how/if the reborn Sindar and Silvan Elves will take part in the war against the Valar. For now they don’t have a reason to join the rebellion – the Valar never really harmed them. Actually, the only ones who have a reason to fight against the Valar at this point are some of the Noldor and maybe the Avari whose entire civilization was destroyed by the Valar’s actions. I imagine the Valar would have to do something truly awful to incite the other Elves to rebellion. And I expect that some of the Vanyar will be fighting on the side of the Valar during the war, so there might be more kinslayings to come.

Caranthir’s rebirth was amazing. His total devotion to his family makes me so happy. I hope Caranthir’s arrival in Valinor will be kept a secret. I don’t even want to think about what the Teleri would do to him if they found out that he had returned. And he will have to hide from the Valar as well. Their power is fading though, so hopefully he can slip in unnoticed.

As for the reborn Elves being stronger - Maglor technically never died, so it will be interesting to see if he will get a power boost or not. He has had a few figurative deaths and rebirths, maybe it will be enough.

I’m glad that Breglos is no longer alone. I thought he would be forced into becoming a cog in the machine that is Menegroth, so his life right now is much better than I expected.

This story is amazing – I can’t wait to read what happens next! Thank you so much for these chapters!

Author's Response:

Thank you for the fantastic review!!

And, as a result, yet another pair of twins from Thingol’s line chooses the Feanorions over their own family.

Yes, I really liked the parallels between the two sets of twins, the way they were both abandoned by family, in their own way, and came to see a Feanorion as their savior/true family.  The Feanorions don’t strike me as people who often or easily adopt outsiders to the extent they did Elrond and Elros, but once they do, they adopt them completely, and bonds of eternal loyalty are forged.

 

“It will be interesting to see what their mother’s perspective on their new relationship with Caranthir will be when she is reborn. 

Yeah, I thought about adding her now, but when I started thinking about her character, I couldn’t see her standing by and doing nothing when her own sons were abused.  She would have either been forced into a slave-bond like Elmo, or killed because she tried to escape with her sons.  I think she was the twins’ only real parent after Dior became enthralled with the Silmaril.  We shall indeed see how she handles things when she is reborn! 

 

Thingol is horrible. Out of the trio of Thingol, Ingwe and Finwe, Finwe is without a doubt the least bad both as a king and as a father, and that’s saying something. 

Yeah, Thingol is by far the worst.  I have no sympathy for him, because he brought about his own corruption, but I will say that he grew this evil because of the dark magic in the slave-bonds.  Caranthir was right when he said they were a pervertion and the kind of thing only a Dark Lord would do.  I therorize that the use of magic this evil has a corrosive effect of Thingol’s soul.  So we see that he has grown a lot worse than he was in Eol’s storyline (even tho he was still a major asshole then), and even worse than he was as king of Doriath, and it’s all because he kept using the slave-bonds and corrupting his own soul.  So he really did bring about his own downfall, and has no one but himself and his lust for power and control to blame.

 

 

I loved how you brought the dead Valar into this. It was interesting to get a glimpse of Melian’s perspective - she seems to think that her freedom from Thingol is only temporary, expecting to be overpowered yet again as soon as he is reborn. I guess the only way to break the cycle is to prevent Thingol from accessing the Land’s magic which he uses to enslave Melian. It’s interesting that the Valar didn’t bother hunting her down and collaring her a second time. I assume Manwe didn’t see Thingol as a threat even if he was armed with a Maia’s power.”

Yes, I think you are right on with Manwe not seeing Thingol as a threat –and I think that ties into the Valar always discounting the Teleri kindred and thinking them the lesser of the other Elves.  If it was Feanor who had a Maia’s power at his fingertips, the Valar would have quickly moved against him.  Tho, I guess it could be said too that the Valar don’t see Thingol as threat to them because he has no ambitions against them, nor any drive to wage war against them.  He’s perfectly content ruling as a god-like emperor over Elves.

You are also right that Melian does not believe she is free –and she is right, she is not.  She can still feel the existence of the slave-bond.  For that matter, so can Elmo and Elurín.  They know that if Thingol is ever reborn he will have ultimate power over them again.  But now there are others NOT bound to him that know the truth, and that truth can be spread, and, like we saw, Thingol can be killed like any other Elf.  So I think he’s in for a quick death when he manages rebirth again.  He does have a space of time between rebirth and remembering who he is when his is extremely vulnerable.  So there is hope for his victims!

 

“All of this has me thinking about how/if the reborn Sindar and Silvan Elves will take part in the war against the Valar. For now they don’t have a reason to join the rebellion – the Valar never really harmed them. Actually, the only ones who have a reason to fight against the Valar at this point are some of the Noldor and maybe the Avari whose entire civilization was destroyed by the Valar’s actions. I imagine the Valar would have to do something truly awful to incite the other Elves to rebellion. And I expect that some of the Vanyar will be fighting on the side of the Valar during the war, so there might be more kinslayings to come.”

You are so right to question whether or not these Elves will join in the rebellion against the Valar!  While it would be nice if all the Elves bound together and saw the Valar as their common foe, I don’t think that is going to happen.  For these Elves, the troubles of Valinor is very far away, and, like you said, none of them have been harmed by the Valar…or at least they don’t see themselves as being harmed, tho it was the Valar who released Morgoth and brought so much destruction upon the world.  But it would take a lot for them to leave their homes to go to a forigen land to fight a seemingly impossible war side-by-side with Noldor who they hate and blame for the destruction of their homes on a far more personal level than the Valar (at least the Sindar do, and they are the ones in control.  And at least half of the pop of new Doriath has been born there and fed Sindarin propaganda from the cradle).

 

“I hope Caranthir’s arrival in Valinor will be kept a secret. I don’t even want to think about what the Teleri would do to him if they found out that he had returned. And he will have to hide from the Valar as well. Their power is fading though, so hopefully he can slip in unnoticed.”

Yes, he is going to have to hide –thankfully he has Elurin as a friend, and even if the Valar would be able to see through any disguise Elurin spelled over Caranthir, other Elves won’t.  But Caranthir is going to have to keep off the Valar’s radar.  But you are right that the Valar’s power is fading, so Caranthir has a chance of slipping through the cracks.  The problem is Caranthir’s personality.  He’s not the most patient of people, and he is driven hard by his need for his family.  Is he going to be able to wait until he has more allies?

 

“As for the reborn Elves being stronger - Maglor technically never died, so it will be interesting to see if he will get a power boost or not. He has had a few figurative deaths and rebirths, maybe it will be enough.”

I am glad you pointed out Maglor’s lack of death!  Caranthir doesn’t know Maglor didn’t die.  I don’t think Maglor will be able to reach his full potential without death.  So he will either face-off against the Valar as he is now, or he will die sometime before the war starts in earnest…..oh we shall see what happens!!! (honestly, I haven’t decided yet).

 

“I’m glad that Breglos is no longer alone. I thought he would be forced into becoming a cog in the machine that is Menegroth, so his life right now is much better than I expected.”

I almost replied that I couldn’t bare to do that to him….but then I remembered I’ve done far worse to other characters :evil laughs:

 

This story is amazing – I can’t wait to read what happens next! Thank you so much for these chapters!

Thank you, you motive me to keep at it and not let myself get overwhelmed with how much there still is to go!  Thank you!!!



Name: Spiced Wine (Signed) · Date: August 31, 2018 11:40 · For: Chapter 14
Finally, after all this time, we see a Feanorion being reborn as they always should have been! And it just seems right that everything comes back to the Flame Imperishable, that which the Valar have coveted from the beginning of time, which was the light within the trees and the Silmarils, but also within the children themselves, and the Valar coveted it in them as well, trying to keep the Flame close. The Valar ever hunger for what they have lost: that feeling of fullness and purity they knew when they still dwelt within Eur's presence,, and now the Flame is the closest they can get to that.

It was a MAGNIFICENT rebirth. It brought tears to my eyes and a thrill to my skin. I want to see them all, and Fingolfin and Fingon return like this, a rebirth into a stronger body, their fëa barely contained, all beauty and glory! A part of The Flame Imperishable that the Valar *cannot* hold or cage!

Author's Response:
:grins: I am so happy you liked it so much!  We shall see what Fingolfin, Fingon, ect rebirths look like....they will defiantly be getting stronger bodies -I don't see how the Elves could fight the Valar without them-- but Caranthir's rebirth was completely natural, there was no outside influences, no one formed a body for him, he created his own....we will see if the Elves out of Mandos are able to take the same route after so long as prisoners of Mandos, which has put their healing on delay.  They may not have time to reach the same epiphany that Caranthir did and might have to pursue a different method...but there were other ideas for rebirth floating around (I am thinking of Celebrimbor), so we will see what happens!



Name: Spiced Wine (Signed) · Date: August 31, 2018 11:18 · For: Chapter 14
I am thrilled you like his relationship with the twins, especially Elured. It was painful to write the parallels between Elured and Curufin that Caranthir kept seeing, and then pieces of his other brothers in him as well, but as painful as it was, I think Caranthir needed it, he needed this connection with the living to stave off the loneliness, and Elured needed him, not only to see the demons in his childhood nightmares as human beings too, but as a protector and friend.

Yes, they both needed it, ironical or not, and it was! I also really like how Caranthir has no guilt about his actions, because why would he? He was bound by the Oath but even of not, he would always have stood with his brothers whatever they did. It really irks me that ‘Kinslayer’ is thrown around so readily. At the Fëanorions. The Elves of Alqualondë were equally Kinslayers, any Elf that killed another was, but the term is always, always set upon the Fëanorions.

Author's Response:

Yeah, to Caranthir, it wasn't about killing Elves, it was about protecting his brothers (and fulfilling the Oath, since he was no more free from its whip than the others).  But he doesn't see what he did as some unforgivable crime.  It was no more evil to him than fighting a war against Dwarves or Mortal Men, and he really hates the Kinslaying accusations -especially when it concern's Doriath.  Those Elves weren't his kin, but it is the hypocrisy of the Sindar that really angers him, the way the Feanorions were only kin when it was convenient for the Sindar to pile on the accusations.



Name: Spiced Wine (Signed) · Date: August 31, 2018 10:31 · For: Chapter 14
At his core, Feanor just wanted to help his people and make the world a better place. Oh, I can't wait for him to be reborn and we finally see that dream come true -with Fingolfin at his side

I think this facet and truth of Fëanor has been long forgotten, and perhaps even Finarfin never knew it or recognised it. But Fingolfin knew it.

Fëanor’s heart roars with passion, and it is a magnificent thing when a person is in love with the way the world could be. Fëanor is beautiful in a way so much more than skin deep.

He did want to make the world better, for his people to fulfil their potential, and he was caged and ignored and stymied at every turn, and feared and eventually fell into madness courtesy of grief and Morgoth, and it is so, so tragic. And even now, I think, he’s there, in Mandos still paying and paying, not just for himself, but for Fingolfin and others. *Weeps*.

Yes. I wish Caranthir had found Maglor and Glorfindel, as his own heart roars with passion and what he finds in Valinor is guaranteed to enrage him.

Author's Response:
"I think this facet and truth of Fëanor has been long forgotten, and perhaps even Finarfin never knew it or recognised it. But Fingolfin knew it."

Yeah, I think that's all too true, and such a tragedy.  So much of who Feanor really was has been forgotten and in it's place is this caricature...no, not even a caricature, for he has been so demonized by some that he isn't even a shadow of himself anymore.  We see this even with Finrod's view of him -his own nephew!  How much worse is it with others?  Even among his own people, I don't think they really remember who he is anymore either.  I am thinking about the way Feanor, and the Silmarils, were viewed in The Price of Duty.  They were lifted to something close to godhood; in their own way, the followers of the Feanorions who had not known Feanor well in Valinor or were born after Feanor died, no more knew who Feanor had really been than the Elves who demonized him.  It's all so sad, and even more so when I think about Curufin.  Feanor's own son had lost the heart of who Feanor was, thinking that getting vengeance would have made Feanor happier than seeing Curufin learning to live on without him.

"Yes. I wish Caranthir had found Maglor and Glorfindel, as his own heart roars with passion and what he finds in Valinor is guaranteed to enrage him."

Yep, Valinor is going to be a tough gauntlet for Caranthir.  I wish he could have reunited with Maglor for both their sakes, but at least there will be people in Valinor who can tell him that Maglor is alive.



Name: Spiced Wine (Signed) · Date: August 31, 2018 10:01 · For: Chapter 11
He was an ass and a sexual predator in his first life, but not a rapist or a man deluded with godhood. But the more perverted soul bonds he used to bound those around him, the more he decayed until he became what we see today.

Yes, I remember not liking Thingol when he was mentioned in Eöl’s memories as being a predatory alpha, but his rebirth that became magnified.

Author's Response:

Yeah, he was selfish and predatory in Eol's memories, and didn't care at all if he wasn't giving Eol pleasure as long as his own desires were met.  So an all around asshole.  But he wasn't evil like he is now.  Really, tho, he did it to himself.  If he hadn't been so drunk on power and control, then he never would have kept tainting his own soul with the dark magic of the soul-bonds (slave bonds, really). 



Name: Spiced Wine (Signed) · Date: August 29, 2018 13:58 · For: Chapter 14
This has been a magnificent update, and the relationship between Elúred, Elúrin and Caranthir has been so fascinating and so poignant. It breaks my heart every time Caranthir remembers or thinks of his loss. The strange relationships too, are incredibly well-written, from Elúrin being the ‘fey’ one (so madly charming, really!) and forgiving Caranthir to Elúred’s hatred and sniping which slowly becomes something different, especially after Caranthir saves his life. All the Fëanorions have this deep urge to protect, too seems, their own kin first, but also others, at times. It’s beautiful. Caranthir is so abrasive, yet so warm.

I loved, loved, his physical rebirth and his staunch, passionate resolve to find his family no matter what, or where, or how!

This was so beautifully written, so deep, so poignant, so disturbing, and so wonderfully real.
Whatever happens to New Doriath now, I am glad Thingol is gone, and that Breglos hopefully has a chance now of finding Eöl.

Author's Response:
"All the Fëanorions have this deep urge to protect, too seems, their own kin first, but also others, at times. It’s beautiful. Caranthir is so abrasive, yet so warm."

Yes, I agree so much with this!  They can be extremely focused on their family unit and protective of their brothers/father to the exclusion of all else when their family is in danger, but they also have a deep core of caring about the woes of the world around them.  Even Caranthir, who seems the least likely of Feanor's sons, wants to help those around him and doesn't like causing hurt -tho he won't shy from hitting back when provoked.  They get it from their father.  At his core, Feanor just wanted to help his people and make the world a better place.  Oh, I can't wait for him to be reborn and we finally see that dream come true -with Fingolfin at his side 

I loved getting to write Caranthir's rebirth.  Finally, after all this time, we see a Feanorion being reborn as they always should have been!  And it just seems right that everything comes back to the Flame Imperishable, that which the Valar have coveted from the beginning of time, which was the light within the trees and the Silmarils, but also within the children themselves, and the Valar coveted it in them as well, trying to keep the Flame close.  The Valar ever hunger for what they have lost: that feeling of fullness and purity they knew when they still dwelt within Eur's presence,, and now the Flame is the closest they can get to that.


Name: Spiced Wine (Signed) · Date: August 29, 2018 11:08 · For: Chapter 12
Caranthir buckled on the knives. /How many guards are posted at Thingol’s chambers? If you are concerned about killing people, tell me a way around them because I have no problem killing them too. They know a lot more about what goes on in their king’s bedroom than you think. As far as I am concerned they are accomplices to hundreds of rapes./

/There are no watchers at the door. The Elves in Cuiviénen are silly. They are playing pretend that there are no wolves in the woods./

/People can be willfully blind to the point of stupidity. If they want to believe they live in a land free of violence, than they will entertain delusions to make it appear so. But Hells, Thingol is an idiot as well as a disgusting piece of trash to not post one guard at his door. Well, good fortune for us./ Caranthir looked around the room that Elurín said served as Eluréd’s holding cell. /Anything you want to take with you? After I kill Thingol we would be idiots not to get out of here as quickly as we can./

/We should wait for Eluréd to come back./ It was not the first time Elurín spoke of waiting for Eluréd.

/No. Callous as it might seem, we have the best chance of taking Thingol by surprise when he is occupied with your brother. Sex gives a man tunnel-vision. So, anything you want?/


Caranthir, you have lost none of what you were, you have the merciless and steel of a Fëanorion sword and it is needed at this time!

Would Elves reborn from Mandos’ jail-cell also possess the ability to easily detect another Elf’s fëa? His family would, of course. He was interested to see if the Power of Maglor’s voice amplified with rebirth, and if his father and Curufin’s connection to gems and metal enhanced. What greater wonders might they bring forth? A reborn Elf’s body was also stronger and hardier, their fëa brighter, humming with a deep well of Power.

I love this concept so much! Once he killed Thingol, Elurín would help him fashion a body of his own, and he would find a way through the Girdle. His family needed him to rescue them from Mandos. Caranthir had no idea how to accomplish such a feat, but he’d be damned if he didn’t kill himself in the attempt. There was no purpose to rebirth outside of his family. There had never been life without them in it. I know, Caranthir, *weeps* and you also have much to say to Curufin!

The breakdown ambushed the boy even more than Caranthir. He sobbed out apologies and promises to be stronger, a stronger protector, a better brother. Caranthir began to suspect the boy had no memory of being the one protected, and reacted to the embrace with instincts raw and over-sensitized by long neglect.

This is all so desperately sad, weaving into Caranthir’s love and passion for his brother, and these two broken twins.



Author's Response:
I am so glad you like Caranthir!  At first glance, the people he meets would think him harsh and uncaring, but he is so much more than that.  He is also steel, and he is not one to give up and let despair take him, he's a fighter to the end....not sure how well that's going to work out for him in the present Valinor tho.  It's too bad he doesn't know about Maglor and Glorfindel, he would have done a lot better meeting up with them and sailing to Valinor together.  
I am thrilled you like his relationship with the twins, especially Elured.  It was painful to write the parallels between Elured and Curufin that Caranthir kept seeing, and then pieces of his other brothers in him as well, but as painful as it was, I think Caranthir needed it, he needed this connection with the living to stave off the loneliness, and Elured needed him, not only to see the demons in his childhood nightmares as human beings too, but as a protector and friend.  


Name: Spiced Wine (Signed) · Date: August 29, 2018 10:45 · For: Chapter 11
Wow, Elwë was entirely unexpected, and he managed to break Melian of the Valar’s hold? How?

But I feel he is in for a crashing fall. He can’t live as if he were a god without the responsibilities of one, not that any of the Valar even have that!

Elúred and Elúrin, my heart breaks for them, but this, this is like the presage of a storm: The secret language of brothers draws close. His coming will break the binder of chains. When the wandering son sails home, death’s dominion will end, and Death’s Gates—”

Oh, my goodness, Elúrin has Caranthir, oh poor things, both of them, there is too much pain here, in this place, which is dreadful, with Elwë, who is worse. Oh, he is really playing out the god-king of the Elves, is he not, and embracing droit de seigneur. There is something too decadent and too wicked about him, but I hope it will not last for long.

Author's Response:
Yes, Thingol ended up being the evil one here.  I can easily see it going the other way tho, and it being Melian who is using him.  Either way, I find their relationship suspicious, what this the centuries long enchantment and all that.  Thingol didn't actually have the power to break the Valar's slave collar, he's just deluded himself into believing it was all him.  Melian knows the truth: it was Porod.  I considered writing a flashback of what happened, but decided against it -for now.  But Nan Elmoth has always been a place of incredible power, and the reason is: it is the place Porod died, so his spirit is strongest there.  Porod is a very ambiguous character tho, he's not evil in the same sense as Morgoth is, but he's not the Elves' friend either.  He cares only about his revenge now.  We can see his lack of morals in what he did to Melian, not only his heart's complete absence of mercy, but that he used dark magic to bind her.  Caranthir was right when he called the perverted soul bonds that bound Melian and the twins, and Elmo too, the work of a Dark Lord.  And I think that they slowly poisoned Thingol as well.  He was an ass and a sexual predator in his first life, but not a rapist or a man deluded with godhood.  But the more perverted soul bonds he used to bound those around him, the more he decayed until he became what we see today.

But new Doriath is free from him now, and the Girdle is broken!  I don't think this will lead to a large migration of Elves out of new Doriath because it is still the place of rebirth, so Elves like Bregolos will stick around for their loved ones to be reborn, and many other Elves were born in new Doriath, so it is the only home they have ever known.  And given the home of the others -Beleriand-- is gone, they will be less motivated to leave.

I am so glad to here your heartstrings were tugged by the poor twins.  They have really had the raw end of the deal.  They didn't even get one good childhood!  They finally have the sense of safety they've been missing, and irony or ironies, they found it with a Feanorion -I couldn't resist lol!


Name: kasura (Signed) · Date: August 29, 2018 6:15 · For: Chapter 14
Just want to do a quick shout out that I love the world building in these new chapters!!! Don't have time to write out all my thoughts...planning to do more in depth reviews this weekend. Sorry to see Thingol is such a sick monster.

squeeallllll Caranthir!!! love that family of choice...and He's coming to Valinor...yay :)

Author's Response:
Yep, Caranthir is finally on his way!!  I can't wait to write him in Valinor, and the twins....we shall see if they get a chance to meet Elwing, tho I doubt it will go well, but then there is the Sirmaril to think of and Carnathir's Oath reawakening...:evil cackles:


I am thrilled to hear you liked the world building!  We will come back to new Doriath later and see how things go down.  Maybe they will be allies against the Valar, maybe not.  
Thank you for letting me know you liked the update :grins:


Name: Kalendeer (Signed) · Date: August 21, 2018 23:18 · For: Chapter 10

They went to Alqualondë!

The part about the destruction of Fëanor's (and other Noldor's) work in the city is amazing wolrd building.

I love your Earwen, she is not perfect, she is strong, she has grudges and it's really hard to mend some relationships once they are damaged. You do have strong queens and I love that <3



Author's Response:
I am happy to hear you liked  Alqualondë and Earwen!  Yeah, her relationship with Finarfin is too broken to ever mend, but she might be able to forgive him in time.  She's so hard on him because his choice to leave with the Exiles after the Kinsalying was a personal betrayal that cut far deeper than Fingolfin or Fingon's choices did.  He had been her husband, and had called her father his father, her people, his people, and for him to turn his back on that -as she saw it-- and choose their killers hurt her to an unspeakable extent.  And her hurt turned to rage which turned to resentment and bitterness over time.  It is going to be hard for her to come to a place of forgiveness.

Thank you so much for these reviews, and the continued support :hugs:


Name: Kalendeer (Signed) · Date: August 21, 2018 22:50 · For: Chapter 9

I wished Finrod could get Curufin back, but he is probably in no shape to help him so perhaps it's a good thing that he is not here :/

The chapter was really sad but there was still some hope in the end for Finrod and Finarfin to get along. I am curious about Earwen. She wants Finrod to come, but can she not got to them instead? She could visit Idril since they are allies (and seeing Anairë again would be great <3 ).



Author's Response:
Yeah, I don't think Curufin being there at the beginning would have been a good idea.  Finrod wasn't in a place, mentally, to deal with his issues with Curufin.  Hopefully when Curufin is reborn, Finrod will have let some of his bitterness go.  I think something that will help him forgive will be seeing Curufin and Feanor interacting -or just getting to know Feanor in general.

There was a lot of sadness in these first chapters, Finrod has so much to work though.  It's like Finarfin saw: he wasn't healed from the trauma of his death; he wasn't ready to be reborn.  But thankfully his spirit has been able to achieve some of that healing with his family.  

Earwen: Yes, technically she could have come to Finrod, but she is too stubborn/proud to set foot in Tirion.  I have a feeling she made some sort of vow never to do so again after the Kinsalying.  She only left  Alqualondë for Finrod and Aegnor's trial, and even then I bet she avoided actually entering Tirion -unless she was able to let some of her hate/resentment go at last for the sake of her sons.


Name: Kalendeer (Signed) · Date: August 21, 2018 22:36 · For: Chapter 8

So Idril won the thing! I love that she is not the perfect queen. The Noldor are such a mess, I wonder how this is going to end and am waiting to see what became of Tirion.

I am also wondering about Nerdanel. I don't think we've seen her yet, but I wonder if she agrees with Finarfin petitions to get the Fëanorian back or if she keeps away from them.



Author's Response:
Yes, Idril got her crown.  I didn't end up writing about the transition of power, and decided on a time jump instead -I hope it wasn't confusing!  I couldn't see Idril making the perfect queen.  Not only would it not fit with her rigid personality, but it would have been too easy, and nothing good ever comes for the poor Noldor lol

Nerdanel: I have plans to show at least a short glimpse into what she's been up to.  Right now tho, she's withdrawn from politics, and maybe life in general to a point.  She has a lot to work through.  Remember that she left her husband -and sons-- largely because of Feanor's outspokenness against the Valar.  If she sees the Valar for what they are now, then that means that Feanor had been right all along, and even if she doesn't agree with his methods, she will have to struggle with a great load of doubts, wondering if things could have been different if she just saw the truth sooner, or if she'd gone into exile with them.  That's a lot to come to terms with, and I don't think she's there yet, because to face the truth means opening the door to all this regret.

But we will see, maybe she's come further along then I think right now, or maybe she's found a way around any regrets and blames some one (Feanor?) for everything....tho I'd like to think she's not so bitter a person to be so blinded.


Name: merwinem (Signed) · Date: August 21, 2018 0:18 · For: Chapter 10
Ohh, these chapters are amazing, thank you! I’ve said this before – I love how you tie up loose ends – it makes the story flow more naturally. Ulmo’s actions in the First Age make sense now. And Aegnor and Angrod becoming more fleshed out – it’s wonderful! I guess Andreth doesn’t exist in this story – I don’t seem to remember her ever being mentioned.

It’s interesting that Earwen never felt imprisoned in Valinor. I suppose the Valar paid less attention to the Teleri than to the Noldor and the Vanyar (thus the Teleri appearing to have more freedom), but it’s not completely clear *why* that was the case. The Valar must have thought that the Teleri were less likely to cause trouble and therefore required less supervision. That is certainly true of the Middle-Earth Teleri with their passive acceptance of the Song and their place in it. However, I didn’t get the impression that the Aman Teleri had the same passivity (Earwen isn’t passive at all, despite being both Teler and a woman).

I wonder if the Teleri’s rejection of Ulmo will have any consequences down the road. I don’t have much hope for it, but it would be interesting if the realization of Ulmo’s true nature acted as a springboard for the Teleri to finally take off their rose-tinted glasses and begin to see Valinor for the prison it truly is. That could be a starting point for mending the breach between the Noldor and the Teleri – after all, Feanor and all those who followed him did have a point about the Valar, which is something that the Teleri refused to acknowledge then and still refuse to acknowledge now.

To be honest I’m getting very fed up with Earwen’s view on justice, her behaviour toward Finarfin, and her desire to turn everything (including her reunion with her own son) into a public spectacle. Honestly, what has Finarfin done to upset her? If she is willing to forgive Fingolfin and Fingon (actual kinslayers), why is she being so horrible to Finarfin? Why is she so determined to kick him when he is already down? From what we have seen, Earwen’s actions aren’t consistent with the qualities of a wise and just leader, which makes me wonder how her rule had remained uncontested for so long. Idril is similar to Earwen in many ways, and Idril’s place on the throne is far from secure.

I appreciate Earwen as a multidimensional character providing a realistic non-Noldor point-of-view, but I just cannot connect with this woman. Holding on to a grudge for 7,000 years – does she really have nothing better to do? It’s exactly the same frustration I had earlier with Thranduil and Celeborn. I feel like Earwen is on her way to join Galadriel at the top of the list of the most irritating female characters in the story, which actually makes sense - Earwen is Galadriel’s role model, after all…

Finrod’s evolution from a broken man reborn in a new body to being metaphorically reborn in the sea was excellent. I cannot wait to see more such transformations involving the other Finwions – the Valar won’t know what hit them! I hope things will finally start improving soon – we’ve put up with three Ages of misery, it’s time for a change!

I noticed that Osse was bound with the chains that Melkor once wore. But wasn’t Feanor’s spirit bound with them when he arrived in Mandos? Does this mean that his “punishment” is finally over? If I remember correctly, the torture was supposed to last for Three Ages, so if this is the Fourth Age maybe he was finally allowed to join the other Kinslayers in their hall… And if this is indeed the Fourth Age, then Elrond will be arriving in Valinor soon… only to learn that Celebrian died. But surely she is almost ready to be reborn too…

Thanks again! The chapters were brilliant!

Author's Response:
Thank you so much for the awesome review!  I was pretty nervous about my portrayal of Finrod -he keeps alluding me :) I am glad to hear you liked Aegnor.  I felt like I didn't have a clear idea of who he was until I started writing him here.  And yes, you are right, no Andreth in this story.  Maybe they were good friends tho, Aegnor could have done with a wise lady in his life, hot-headed as he is lol  Can you imagine the clashes between him and Galadriel?  I can't see them getting on at all.

You are right that the Valar didn't pay much attention to the Teleri (other then the sea-gods).  I think the Valar simply didn't care as much for the Teleri as they did the other Elven kindreds.  They thought the Teleri were the 'least' of all the Elves, both because they didn't create much the Valar coveted and because they were the farthest from the Valar's idea of ideal beauty, which the Vanyar met best, and because they were slow to make the journey west.  So, the Valar didn't get as involved in the Teleri's lives/ impose their will on them as much.  And the sea-gods weren't as interested in heavy-handed control as the Manwe and his crew, so the Teleri were left largely to thmeselves -which is why Eanwe considered herself free.  But if the Teleri had taken one step towards leaving Valinor with the Noldor, they would have discovered how very not-free they were.

I think you are right to doubt that the Ulmo's fall will have the effect of uniting the Teleri and Noldor.  If Manwe had punished Finrod and Aegnor, then it could have gone that way, but with the Valar seeming to hold to justice, the Valar added no fuel to the fire -Manwe was unintentionally clever in not punishing them.  but I think you are on to something with the idea that the Teleri need to experience what the Noldor did, what drove Feanor and company to rebel against the Valar in the first place, before they are able to forgive.

I am not surprised to hear you are fed up with Earwen’'s attitude -Aegnor certainly is too!  I think the reason she still holding on to rule without opposition is because her views are shared by most of her people, they are as stuck in the past as she is.  You make an excellent point about how frustrating it is that the Teleri/Earwen don't seem to have moved on at all from the Kinslaying.  Why not?  I think the key to their frozen existence is that they have not experienced anything truly terrible after the Kinsalying.  The Kinslaying is still the greatest wound their society has ever received.  The only other horror these Elves have experienced was back when they were running from the Dark Hunter/Melkor.  On the other hand, the Noldor have experienced so many other horrors and so much other suffering.  Something to note is that the Noldor in Tirion who were instrumental in changing the Noldor's society and not keeping it just as frozen as the Teleri's were the ones who'd experienced the War of Wrath.  As horrible as the kinslaying was, the War of Wrath was so much worse, it lasted for 40 years, and involved countedless battles and scenes of horror.  It doesn't help, of course, that Elven memory makes 'moving past' something so much more difficult for them than a Human whose memories fade with time.

As for Earwen's attitude towards Finarfin, and seeming hypocrisy when it comes to Fingolfin and Fingon....well, I don't think for a moment she forgives Fingolfin or Fingon, merely that she pardons them from enduring the punishments she/the Teleri plan to put on Feanor and his people.  When it comes to Finarfin tho, his betrayal is personal.  Fingolfin and Fingon are people she may not have even considered friends, but Finarfin was her husband and the Father of her children.  He not only kept following the people who'd murdered the people he'd claimed to love, even Olwe, the man who was as much/more than a father to him than Finwe ever was, but he also 'took' their children with him.  She blames him for their children's choices to go into Exile with the Noldor.  So, in her mind, not only did he pick a much of murderers who had never even been a proper family to him like her own had been, he also committed the unforgivable crime of dragging their children into his folly.  For Earwen the Kinslaying was a traumatizing event that destroyed her family.  The betrayal she felt when Finarfin (and her children, but she's forgiven them by pretending they were too young to understand what they did) walked away from her with the murderers of her people, leaving her alone with a new crown and a traumatized people, was monumental.  Even tho it has been thousands of years, she hasn't come to a place of forgiveness.  Maybe she will tho!  I have more hope for her then I do for Galadreil. 

"Finrod’s evolution from a broken man reborn in a new body to being metaphorically reborn in the sea was excellent."

Thank you!  This makes me so happy to hear :)

"I noticed that Osse was bound with the chains that Melkor once wore. But wasn’t Feanor’s spirit bound with them when he arrived in Mandos?"

That's a mistake on my part!  I forgot Feanor was still chained with them.  I am sure Alue can make some other chains for Osse.  We are not quite to the 4th Age yet -but soon!-- so Feanor is still balancing the scales....gods, that's really horrifying to think about.  If he didn't have an iron-will he would have long gone insane.  We still have some years before Elrond comes, Celebrain is indeed close to being reborn, we will see if he gets there first.

Thank you so, so much for this review and your support, you got me thinking more about Earwen's character :) 



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